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  #141  
Old 08-27-2011, 09:42 AM
Sinocelt Sinocelt is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin the Martian View Post
Before somebody jumps in and says "memory cards are cheaper than internal memory anyways"
Not when you lose them....

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  #142  
Old 08-27-2011, 09:43 AM
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And they're easy to lose, being that small.
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  #143  
Old 08-27-2011, 10:15 AM
Aevum Aevum is offline
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Am i the only one thinking that the screen should have atleast have an orientation now that its square insted of rectangular.

a g-sensor would be nice but after all. its a bloody clip.

  #144  
Old 08-27-2011, 10:26 AM
skip252 skip252 is offline
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Does anyone really think that Sandisk hasn't taken all the "more internal memory vs. making them buy cards?" into consideration? I have to believe that at least part of the reason they limit internal memory is to help drive the sales of memory cards. I know if I was the world's largest maker of memory cards I would.

Put enough internal memory on it to satisfy the average user. There's no doubt market studies in place to let them know what the sweet spot is. Notice there's no 2 GB model this time. I'd guess that might mean the research says the average user has a larger library now. BTW if you have more than say, 5 posts here, you ain't the average user.

Then have an expansion slot for those of us that want more. Bingo, ready made sales with very little effort. If you lose one the smiles in the Sales dept. just get bigger. More sales with no effort. You can't even get mad at them. They didn't lose it.

  #145  
Old 08-27-2011, 10:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skip252 View Post
Nice job. A couple of questions. Responsiveness when fully loaded and refresh time. What's your experience with those?
OK, player now loaded with MP3's, 6.96GB on the internal, 14.8GB on a class 2 16GB card. Still flies through menus, and the refresh time just now was 2:53.6.....two minutes, fifty-three point six seconds. Of course, YMMV with regards to the refresh time, depending on your tagging practices.

Edit: That is 2,685 songs, average bitrate of the lot is 233kbps.
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Last edited by Marvin the Martian; 08-27-2011 at 11:00 AM.

  #146  
Old 08-27-2011, 10:51 AM
skip252 skip252 is offline
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I figured the response time in the UI would be pretty good when I found it was running the same hardware. It was the resemblance the the Fuze+ UI that made me wonder.

IIRC that database refresh for you is quicker than with the Clip+? If so by about what % approximately?

Last edited by skip252; 08-27-2011 at 10:59 AM.

  #147  
Old 08-27-2011, 11:05 AM
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Marvin the Martian Marvin the Martian is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skip252 View Post
I figured the response time in the UI would be pretty good when I found it was running the same hardware. It was the resemblance the the Fuze+ UI that made me wonder.

IIRC that database refresh for you is quicker than with the Clip+? If so by about what % approximately?
That's the next test on my list.....I'm currently copying the tracks on the internal memory of the CZ onto the Clip+. Once that is complete, I'll switch the card over, and then track the C+ refresh time.
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  #148  
Old 08-27-2011, 11:57 AM
Sinocelt Sinocelt is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skip252 View Post
You can't even get mad at them. They didn't lose it.
I'm sure they made them so small on purpose. I never lost a floppy disk!

  #149  
Old 08-27-2011, 12:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Marvin the Martian View Post
OK, player now loaded with MP3's, 6.96GB on the internal, 14.8GB on a class 2 16GB card. Still flies through menus, and the refresh time just now was 2:53.6.....two minutes, fifty-three point six seconds. Of course, YMMV with regards to the refresh time, depending on your tagging practices.

Edit: That is 2,685 songs, average bitrate of the lot is 233kbps.
OK, same tracks on the Clip+ results in a refresh time of 3:20.8.....three minutes, twenty point eight seconds.

I'll let the engineers figure out why the new player would refresh faster.
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  #150  
Old 08-27-2011, 12:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skip252 View Post
IIRC that database refresh for you is quicker than with the Clip+? If so by about what % approximately?
So with Marv's numbers, about 15% faster.
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  #151  
Old 08-27-2011, 01:18 PM
Mikerman Mikerman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carson Dyle View Post
What's the verdict on the Clip Zip's redesigned D-Pad? Looks more difficult to use to me than that of the Clip+, especially for those with large hands.
Personally, I don't like unipads and rockers of that type, and was a bit concerned when I saw the Clip Zip. I much prefer discrete buttons.

In actual operation, though, the Clip Zip's pad works just fine for me, as well as the pads on the original Clip and Clip+.

With a qualification: the pad on the Clip Zip is smaller than before, now a third (before, a half) of the face of the player. And the select button is fairly thin. And so there could be at least some initial "finger overlap," especially for those with larger fingers. But I think that most of this will go away with the development of "finger memory."

Quote:
Originally Posted by abhi_jollyguy View Post
@Marvin the Martian

An excellent review, Could you please shed some light on the SQ part? Is it better than the clip+ or equal to the clip+?

Thanks
I never liked the EQs of the original Clip and Clip+, and just left the EQ set to Normal--the best sound, it seemed to me.

In some brief testing of the Clip Zip's EQ, however, it seems to be improved and even acceptable, at least in some of the presets--in some of the others it still sounds harsh and tinny to me.

In the end, personally, I'll still generally keep my player's EQ set to Normal, although others may start to like the EQ more, especially as customized by them (that option remains).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sinocelt View Post
Where did you get the 8 Gb version? I can't find it in stock.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rapide_23 View Post
Who sells the clip zip atm?
When I checked a couple of days ago, Amazon.com had begun selling the Clip Zip. Some of the 4GB colors were going for $5 below full retail, while others were at full retail. And the 8GB player was going for $5 above full retail.

The best deal I've seen has been at, of all places, SanDisk's own online store. Having the full line of Clip Zips, SanDisk is selling the players at the full retail cost. Ah, but then, if you register with SanDisk before buying, you get 10% off your first purchase. And then, through September 6, SanDisk is shipping for free. And then, once more through September 6, SanDisk is throwing in a real nice and nifty (albeit a bit thick) carry case with carabiner (retail price: $15).

Unless you want to buy local (although I don't see a great reason here to do so) or to wait for prices to come down, the SanDisk store seems to be the way to go.

http://shop.sandisk.com/store?Action...SiteID=sdiskus

  #152  
Old 08-27-2011, 01:29 PM
Mikerman Mikerman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skip252 View Post
Does anyone really think that Sandisk hasn't taken all the "more internal memory vs. making them buy cards?" into consideration? I have to believe that at least part of the reason they limit internal memory is to help drive the sales of memory cards. I know if I was the world's largest maker of memory cards I would.

Put enough internal memory on it to satisfy the average user. There's no doubt market studies in place to let them know what the sweet spot is. Notice there's no 2 GB model this time. I'd guess that might mean the research says the average user has a larger library now. BTW if you have more than say, 5 posts here, you ain't the average user.

Then have an expansion slot for those of us that want more. Bingo, ready made sales with very little effort. If you lose one the smiles in the Sales dept. just get bigger. More sales with no effort. You can't even get mad at them. They didn't lose it.
I think the driving force behind the offering of 4GB and 8GB versions is SanDisk's Marketing and where it sees the greatest customer demand and opportunity. But then, agreed, having the expansion slot means that SanDisk builds in potential further sales. I guess just like the fruit company's players, where expansion slots are being avoided like the plague, to the customer's great financial and other detriment, seemingly to force customers to expand memory size by wastefully (for anybody but the fruit company) buying a whole new--and expensive--player.

  #153  
Old 08-27-2011, 01:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skip252 View Post
Does anyone really think that Sandisk hasn't taken all the "more internal memory vs. making them buy cards?" into consideration? I have to believe that at least part of the reason they limit internal memory is to help drive the sales of memory cards. I know if I was the world's largest maker of memory cards I would.

Put enough internal memory on it to satisfy the average user. There's no doubt market studies in place to let them know what the sweet spot is. Notice there's no 2 GB model this time. I'd guess that might mean the research says the average user has a larger library now. BTW if you have more than say, 5 posts here, you ain't the average user.

Then have an expansion slot for those of us that want more. Bingo, ready made sales with very little effort. If you lose one the smiles in the Sales dept. just get bigger. More sales with no effort. You can't even get mad at them. They didn't lose it.
My one counterpoint to that argument is this.....the profit margin is higher on the internal memory than it is on the cards. So even if they sell mostly 4GB models, it would seem logical to me to at least offer a higher capacity model with a slot for those who want more than the 40GB possible with an 8GB player with an SDHC slot.....even if you don't produce as many physical units as the 4GB and 8GB models. After all, Apple still sells a lot of 160GB iPod Classics.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikerman View Post
I think the driving force behind the offering of 4GB and 8GB versions is SanDisk's Marketing and where it sees the greatest customer demand and opportunity. But then, agreed, having the expansion slot means that SanDisk builds in potential further sales. I guess just like the fruit company's players, where expansion slots are being avoided like the plague, to the customer's great financial and other detriment, seemingly to force customers to expand memory size by wastefully (for anybody but the fruit company) buying a whole new--and expensive--player.
It's unfair to single Apple(yes, we can call them by name) out for this practice of no card slot....they are not the only ones that do this. Sony does the same thing, and there are probably others that don't immediately come to mind that also do it.
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Last edited by Marvin the Martian; 08-27-2011 at 02:35 PM.

  #154  
Old 08-27-2011, 02:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin the Martian View Post
My one counterpoint to that argument is this.....the profit margin is higher on the internal memory than it is on the cards. So even if they sell mostly 4GB models, it would seem logical to me to at least offer a higher capacity model for those who want more than the 40GB possible with an 8GB player with an SDHC slot.....even if you don't produce as many physical units as the 4GB and 8GB models. After all, Apple still sells a lot of 160GB iPod Classics.
But profit margin on internal memory + cards is more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin the Martian View Post
It's unfair to single Apple(yes, we can call them by name) out for this practice of no card slot....they are not the only ones that do this. Sony does the same thing, and there are probably others that don't immediately come to mind that also do it.
Zune...
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  #155  
Old 08-27-2011, 02:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steinburger1109 View Post
But profit margin on internal memory + cards is more.
Which is why I suggested a higher capacity model that still has an SDHC slot.
oops.....meant it but didn't say it that way....edit made!

Quote:
Originally Posted by steinburger1109 View Post
Zune...
I forgot about them.....lol.
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  #156  
Old 08-27-2011, 03:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Marvin the Martian View Post
Which is why I suggested a higher capacity model that still has an SDHC slot.
oops.....meant it but didn't say it that way....edit made!
It's still less effective because if I can buy a 32GB player, why would I by a 16+16 or some other division? And the 16+16 would have a higher profit margin than 32 internal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin the Martian View Post
I forgot about them.....lol.
Everyone does... hahaha
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  #157  
Old 08-27-2011, 03:21 PM
Carson Dyle Carson Dyle is offline
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I think the main reason for only offering up to 8GB capacity is a desire to keep the Clip positioned as a lower-end player (from a marketing and consumer viewpoint) in comparison to their own Fuze.

  #158  
Old 08-27-2011, 03:25 PM
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Originally Posted by steinburger1109 View Post
It's still less effective because if I can buy a 32GB player, why would I by a 16+16 or some other division?
The 16GB with 16GB card would be cheaper than a 32GB internal. Do a little price checking...
The point of the higher capacity model having a slot is that you could add a 32GB card to that 16GB player, and have more memory than you would by doing 16+16, or 8+32.

Quote:
Originally Posted by steinburger1109 View Post
And the 16+16 would have a higher profit margin than 32 internal.
No it wouldn't...the 16GB cards are wicked cheap.
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  #159  
Old 08-27-2011, 03:26 PM
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It's not like the 16GB capacity of the Fuze+ is overly awesome as well... but yeah, Sandisk probably can't/won't sell enough 32/64GB units to justify that much internal memory (next to the already mentioned fact that they're the world's largest SD card manufacturers).
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  #160  
Old 08-27-2011, 03:38 PM
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Default Diagnostic mode

Quote:
Originally Posted by bertrik View Post
Have you tried to enter the diagnostic mode already?

On the clip+ this can be enabled by flashing a firmware ending in a 't' (for test presumably), like clpzt.bin instead of clpza.bin.
The firmware file can be found here: http://mp3support.sandisk.com/firmwa...ip01.01.12.zip
Another way is to press and hold all buttons at once during boot, although I have mixed success with that on my clip+.
After flashing a 't' version, there should be a an extra menu item somewhere under system or settings.
OK, here is what I found.....
Attached Images
File Type: jpg DSCN0345.JPG (186.2 KB, 153 views)
File Type: jpg DSCN0346.JPG (180.5 KB, 146 views)
File Type: jpg DSCN0347.JPG (180.1 KB, 136 views)
File Type: jpg DSCN0348.JPG (184.6 KB, 134 views)
File Type: jpg DSCN0349.JPG (166.6 KB, 161 views)
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