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  #1  
Old 08-19-2011, 06:38 PM
Batman8001 Batman8001 is offline
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Default Does anyone have a definitive guide to Playlists on the J3?

I have a J3 32GB and it is just about racked full of mp3s.
After pouring through these forums and iAudiophile I have shot blanks on all accords to get a play list that handles more than 400 songs.
I am curious if anyone has a definite way to create a large playlist on the j3?
A few notes:
All the music is already on the player and WMP just wants to load it on there again.
I tried the M3U route, but that is where I hit the 400 song cap.
I tried the JetAudio route but that apparently does not work on the J3.
I tried the MTP/.pla route, but that is also capped at 400 songs.
I would like to create a playlist with 1200+ songs.

Any help would be much appreciated, I have been at this for several days and have had zero luck.
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  #2  
Old 08-20-2011, 06:18 AM
DSperber DSperber is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Batman8001 View Post
I have a J3 32GB and it is just about racked full of mp3s.
I assume that means you don't use an external storage SD card, but rather only have a 32GB J3. Yes? Or do you have an external card as well?


Quote:
After pouring through these forums and iAudiophile I have shot blanks on all accords to get a play list that handles more than 400 songs.
I think you're right there... M3U playlists seem to be limited to referencing no more than 400 files.


Quote:
I tried the M3U route, but that is where I hit the 400 song cap.
That would appear to be true.

Even worse, M3U on the J3 only supports music files on the same storage where the M3U file itself is stored. So if you put the M3U playlist file on internal storage, then the music files referenced must also be located on internal storage. Put the M3U file on external storage and its referenced music files must also be on external storage. An M3U file cannot reference music files on BOTH internal and external storage (the "wrong" ones will simply be ignored by the J3).


Quote:
I tried the JetAudio route but that apparently does not work on the J3.
I can't swear to it because I was so turned off by the inscrutable user interface of JetAudio when I tried it that I immediately uninstalled it, so I never really got far into trying out its features.

However I'd be doubtful that JetAudio can't handle playlists for the J3, since JetAudio is Cowon's software.

Anyway, if JetAudio produces an M3U playlist file then you're back where you started, at a 400 file max.


Quote:
I tried the MTP/.pla route, but that is also capped at 400 songs.
I don't use MTP/PLA since it's difficult and cumbersome to work with, since there are no drive letters with MTP and you have to use Windows Explorer pretty much for everything... and it's certainly not terribly friendly.

I did experiment with it extensively (you'll find my posts on playlists throughout this forum as well as the iaudiophile.net forum).

PLA on the J3 has the advantage of being able to refer to music files on both internal and external storage, which is great if you have an external SD card. But I never knew that there is the same 400 song maximum even for PLA. Very disappointing.


Quote:
I would like to create a playlist with 1200+ songs.

Any help would be much appreciated, I have been at this for several days and have had zero luck.
Ok... here's your ONLY option: "genre-playlist".

Assuming (1) your music files all have valid ID3 or FLAC or APE tags in them, and assuming (2) you don't mind the limitation to my idea that requires a single music file to be in no more than one genre-playlist (since there's only one "genre" field in tags), and assuming (3) you don't really care about "genre" and will not really want to browse your music collection by true "genre", then you can simply assign "genre" values in your tags to something like "Playlist1", "Playlist2", etc. (or whatever name you care to make up).

Since there is NO LIMIT to the number of music files in the J3's tags field database, you can have any number of music files in one of these genre-playlists.

Furthermore, they will include music files on both internal and external storage, because the J3's tags database covers ALL music files on the J3 no matter where they live.

You can use a program like MP3Tag (it depends on Windows drive letters like most Windows programs, so you need to have the J3 in MSC mode) if you don't already have it installed, to perform mass-changes on selected music files (either (a) located on your PC and then copied over to the J3 after working on them, or (b) located directly on the J3).

Just stuff "Playlist1" into the "genre" tag field of all selected files you want to be in that playlist, and when you get it onto the J3 they will all show up in the Library -> [Genres] -> [Playlist1]... no matter how many files have that same "genre" value.

Etc., etc.


Note that I believe you can do the same kind of thing with the "year" tag field, assuming you have no plans to browse your music collection by year.

In this case you would do the same thing, to use MP3Tag to stuff some made up common year for Playlist 1, another common year for Playlist 2, etc.

You'd now pick your playlist using Library -> [Years] -> and then pick the special year that corresponds to Playlist 1, etc.

Same result, and it would allow you to keep true "genre" if you really did want to retain that ability.

But also the same limitation of only one playlist assignable for each music file, since there's only one "year" tag field analyzed by the J3 firmware.
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  #3  
Old 08-21-2011, 08:42 PM
Batman8001 Batman8001 is offline
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-Yes, Music is on the internal storage. I use the SD, but only for video.
-You are right, JetAudio is terrible, but I fought with it to see if it works. I picked up in iAudiophile that it does not work on the J3. Maybe that was an old post and I did something wrong. I too would expect it to work on their equipment, so I will give that another shot.
-I hear you on the Genre idea, I have that in play already. However, I am trying to put the same song into several different playlists. I appreciate the heads up on the year as I will do that. The only suck part of that is that I keep the year square on my master copies, so this might be dicey when copy-pasting in and out of the master copies.
-I assume that you do not make PLA playlists that are larger than 400 songs? I only experimented lightly before running into the 400 song roadblock and walking away. If anyone has made a PLA with more than 400 songs I would love to hear about it because while this is cumbersome; if it works, I'll take it.
-I think most of my frustration is that the J3 is a solid device and has performed flawlessly for me thus far, but this seems to be a sizable drawback to an otherwise immaculate device. I am going to attempt to contact Cowon about this, but have no idea what that process is like.
-Thanks, DSperber, for your thoughts on this. If I come up with anything definitive I will post and let everyone know about it.
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  #4  
Old 08-22-2011, 05:44 AM
DSperber DSperber is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Batman8001 View Post
-I hear you on the Genre idea, I have that in play already. However, I am trying to put the same song into several different playlists.
Not going to work if you need a song to be in more than one playlist, I'm afraid, as we both already know.

Unfortunately, ANY proposed solution/hack or workaround other than genuine product support for M3U playlists larger than 400 files is guaranteed to require some kind of compromise or limitation.


Quote:
I appreciate the heads up on the year as I will do that.
I don't follow... using year instead of genre is really no different in that it still only allows putting a song into one playlist.

I must be missing what you're getting at, from what I'd said originally.

Quote:
The only suck part of that is that I keep the year square on my master copies, so this might be dicey when copy-pasting in and out of the master copies.
Absolutely. Same with fooling with genre, if you really did want to keep that data true in your collection.


Quote:
I assume that you do not make PLA playlists that are larger than 400 songs? I only experimented lightly before running into the 400 song roadblock and walking away. If anyone has made a PLA with more than 400 songs I would love to hear about it because while this is cumbersome; if it works, I'll take it.
To be honest, I don't use any playlists at all. It's just too much trouble to try and overcome the limitations. M3U doesn't support both internal and external storage, and PLA is super-difficult to work with because it requires MTP and Windows Explorer (and you can never ever go back to MSC or else you'll have just actually and physically destroyed your PLA playlists, and they cannot be repaired but must be deleted/rebuilt!).

I played with PLA playlists early on, and discovered how they got built, and that they supported music on both internal and external storage. But it was so impossibly cumbersome to use the J3 in MTP mode (thus restricting its maintenance function to only Windows Explorer) that I quit pursuing it.

So I may know about PLA on a technical and experimental and theoretical level, but I certainly never actually used it for real.


Quote:
I think most of my frustration is that the J3 is a solid device and has performed flawlessly for me thus far, but this seems to be a sizable drawback to an otherwise immaculate device. I am going to attempt to contact Cowon about this, but have no idea what that process is like.
You can reach them as described in this other post.

But don't necessarily expect a meaningful response. English is their second language, and it's mostly their mechanism for bug reporting and acknowledgement. However their "acknowledgement" is pretty boilerplate, although several major bugs I've reported that way have actually resulted in immediate fixes in new firmware versions (and stated in their changelogs).
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  #5  
Old 08-24-2011, 10:29 PM
Batman8001 Batman8001 is offline
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-Using both the year and the genre field I should be able to create 2 subsets of music. Right now I use the genre to group music, no I can use the year as a rudimentary playlist. Follow?

-I will give the communications a shot. Thanks.
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  #6  
Old 08-25-2011, 01:04 AM
DSperber DSperber is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Batman8001 View Post
-Using both the year and the genre field I should be able to create 2 subsets of music. Right now I use the genre to group music, no I can use the year as a rudimentary playlist. Follow?
Sure... if you're ok with treating these two tag fields simply as two user-defined playlist names per tag, then a single music file can thus be referenced in TWO different playlists. And if that's adequate, and you don't use genre or year to browse, then you're golden!

(I haven't tried putting anything other than a normal 4-digit year in the "year" tag field, so you may need to experiment a bit to see what the Browser expects to find in the database for this field in order to substitute something acceptable to the Browser and yet which yields your "playlist name/number".)
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