Which Tablet OS Do You Think Has the Best Chance Against the iPad?

[EnzoTen]

Here are my thoughts:

Android:
We are starting to see some of these trickle out now. The Dell Streak and the Samsung Galaxy Tab. Android in 2.1+ form is as powerful or more powerful than the iPad in terms of features. The thing that it troubling is fragmentation of the OS with the addition of manufactures own "skins" on top of the pure android build. What adds to the frustration is that these skins hold up releases of new Android versions. Im going though this with my HTC Incredible. Stuck on 2.1 because HTC has to rework and test their Sense Skin. Perhaps this all gets better with Android 3.0.

BlackPad:
This will end up being a nice product. Corporations love the BB security and they may tie in well to a phone. But in terms of the OS, its years behind and im not confident that RIM can come up with something to rival on the consumer front. But maybe the uptake of the blackpad will happen in financial and secure corporate institutions.

HP/Palm Web OS
I have little experience with WebOS other than a half hour or so in the store. But i think it might translate pretty well to a tablet situation. One of the biggest drawbacks of the iPad is that its oversimplification lends to a very poor multi tasking experience (and at this time none). The mechanics of the WebOS's UI are awesome and i can see getting real work done on it.

Windows
I love my Lenovo X200. It offers no sacrifice in terms of productivity, but it falls flat on its face in tablet mode and this is mostly due to the un-finger-friendly OS. I do believe that a touch freindly plus a stylus is the ultimate scenario for tablets, but they must be able to operate independently. As of now, its not even close. So with that said I think there is the most potential in Windows Tablets, but my concern is MS being agile enough to pull this off in a timely manner.

Windows Phone Tablet? Could MS potentially come out with another chassis class for a tablet based on the Windows Phone OS. Perhaps they quad their display and release 1600x960 tablet? Zune Tablet?

Nokia
I dont expect Nokia to be a competitor at all. They have serious organization and management issues company wide. I dont see them turning it around in 2011 or at all.


My Vote:
My vote is for Android since i think there are a lot in line with the release of 3.0- ultimately they will trump the iPad definitely in the near future. But what i personally want it a Windows Tablet that gives me a good experience in tablet mode and has the power in terms of usability and apps of a laptop. I dont want two devices. But with MSs recent mobile track record i cant say they will be the one to come out on top.

[medion]

My thoughts:

Android:

Tablets with 3.0 and powered by Tegra 2 should start shipping by end of Q1 2011. These tablets will be the first true answer to the Ipad (well, the Galaxy Tab should do well as well). Once we have these higher end tablets, the combination of these and the entry-level models should combine to gradually outsell the iPad.

Blackpad:

Part of the appeal of the iPad is that you do not NEED an iPhone. Everything I've seen states that the Blackpad must be tethered to a Blackberry. If true, then they're only selling this to an existing userbase, and not a potential userbase.

Windows:

Microsoft wants to put Windows 7 on tablets, while some manufacturers are calling for WP7. Since tablets are a touchscreen-only affair (before addons, which usually appeal to a smaller demographic), going with WP7 would be the smarter choice. MS has set themselves up to fail here. It's not like Google, who have a clear strategy (Chrome OS on desktop/laptop/netbook, Android on tablet and smartphone).

Nokia:

I don't think they've announced anything yet, but I could see Meego being a later but serious competitor in the field.

And to respond to some of the above concerns:

Stuck on 2.1 because HTC has to rework and test their Sense Skin. Perhaps this all gets better with Android 3.0.

Right now it's Verizon holding us up, but for good reason. HTC got their 2.2 update out on the Desire and Evo fairly quick (both running Sense). Not sure on the Desire, but the Evo has some serious issues. Unlike Sprint, Verizon doesn't just stamp "approved" on an update, they seriously test it. Supposedly, the Dinc's update has been pushed back to HTC several times already.

But I agree with the spirit of what you're saying. Custom skins slow down updates. Personally, I'd love to see just a vanilla Android release that you could download and install on a wiped phone, much like inserting a Windows 7 disc and reformatting my PC. I think we'll eventually get there once some hardware unification and better driver support for the OS occurs.

[roguemat]

Originally Posted by medion

Part of the appeal of the iPad is that you do not NEED an iPhone. Everything I've seen states that the Blackpad must be tethered to a Blackberry. If true, then they're only selling this to an existing userbase, and not a potential userbase.

Blackberry isnt trying to sell an oversized phone thought :P

[rickysio]

Originally Posted by medion

My thoughts:

Android:

Tablets with 3.0 and powered by Tegra 2 should start shipping by end of Q1 2011. These tablets will be the first true answer to the Ipad (well, the Galaxy Tab should do well as well). Once we have these higher end tablets, the combination of these and the entry-level models should combine to gradually outsell the iPad.

Blackpad:

Part of the appeal of the iPad is that you do not NEED an iPhone. Everything I've seen states that the Blackpad must be tethered to a Blackberry. If true, then they're only selling this to an existing userbase, and not a potential userbase.

Windows:

Microsoft wants to put Windows 7 on tablets, while some manufacturers are calling for WP7. Since tablets are a touchscreen-only affair (before addons, which usually appeal to a smaller demographic), going with WP7 would be the smarter choice. MS has set themselves up to fail here. It's not like Google, who have a clear strategy (Chrome OS on desktop/laptop/netbook, Android on tablet and smartphone).

Nokia:

I don't think they've announced anything yet, but I could see Meego being a later but serious competitor in the field.

And to respond to some of the above concerns:



Right now it's Verizon holding us up, but for good reason. HTC got their 2.2 update out on the Desire and Evo fairly quick (both running Sense). Not sure on the Desire, but the Evo has some serious issues. Unlike Sprint, Verizon doesn't just stamp "approved" on an update, they seriously test it. Supposedly, the Dinc's update has been pushed back to HTC several times already.

But I agree with the spirit of what you're saying. Custom skins slow down updates. Personally, I'd love to see just a vanilla Android release that you could download and install on a wiped phone, much like inserting a Windows 7 disc and reformatting my PC. I think we'll eventually get there once some hardware unification and better driver support for the OS occurs.

Additional thoughts - WinPhone 7 doesn't look suited for a Tablet OS - it would need quite a large UI overhaul - it simply doesn't allow for efficient usage of the additional screen area.

That's what WinCE 7 (or something) is for - too bad Asus canned that tablet running it (AFAIK).

Blackpad... I don't think it'd attract much people, except those that want the BB service. Blackberries attract because of their QWERTY keyboards, but there's almost no chance of a keyboard appearing, by the sounds of it.

Android 3.0 + decent hardware should be one of the first true competitors to the iPad. Not much details on the new UI though.

MeeGo wise, the UI Intel showed was pretty amazing. I'd be happy to use it - and it's just preliminary UI.

Nokia'd be unlikely to compete in tablets - IIRC they said that at this point they aren't interested in that market yet. Their Internet Tablets are after all, not really tablets - their far too small screen...

As for UI, I'd think many would appreciate it if companies worked like SPB - make the custom UI optional, and separate from the OS. So now at least you have a choice - upgrade and wait for the UI to be ported over, or remain, rather than being forced to remain.

[EnzoTen]

Originally Posted by rickysio

Additional thoughts - WinPhone 7 doesn't look suited for a Tablet OS - it would need quite a large UI overhaul - it simply doesn't allow for efficient usage of the additional screen area.

Windows Phone 7 UI is designed to work on various screen sizes and resolutions. I think you have to have used the Zune HD, Kin, or WP7 to understand this. In addition to the UI being scalable real time, they way that you scroll horizontally thought lists and vertically though panels as part of the navigation make is very easy to add pixels to the right or bottom on the UI. This becomes very apparent when you compare the Kin ONE to the Kin Two. Same UI, but the Kin ONE is half the resolution, yet still manages to be just as usable. You just have to do more horizontal scrolling. A good example is the use of these "Hubs". These are panoramic tiles that when on a portrait oriented screen it can be scrolled thought horizontally. If you had more pixels, say a tablet in landscape mode, you can see the entire hub instead of having the scroll. So really the screen real estate in terms of pixels will depend on how much scrolling your will ave to do.

Here is a really good visual explanation: http://www.betanews.com/article/This...ies/1266247752

[Marvin the Martian]

Given that HP cancelled their planned Win 7 tablet, I can't think why else they would have bought Palm, which was going under, unless they had high hopes for the WebOS....so that is my SWAG prediction.

[rickysio]

Originally Posted by EnzoTen

Windows Phone 7 UI is designed to work on various screen sizes and resolutions. I think you have to have used the Zune HD, Kin, or WP7 to understand this. In addition to the UI being scalable real time, they way that you scroll horizontally thought lists and vertically though panels as part of the navigation make is very easy to add pixels to the right or bottom on the UI. This becomes very apparent when you compare the Kin ONE to the Kin Two. Same UI, but the Kin ONE is half the resolution, yet still manages to be just as usable. You just have to do more horizontal scrolling. A good example is the use of these "Hubs". These are panoramic tiles that when on a portrait oriented screen it can be scrolled thought horizontally. If you had more pixels, say a tablet in landscape mode, you can see the entire hub instead of having the scroll. So really the screen real estate in terms of pixels will depend on how much scrolling your will ave to do.

Here is a really good visual explanation: http://www.betanews.com/article/This...ies/1266247752

This is what happens when Microsoft doesn't sell their hardware in Singapore. Or any country other than the US.

I don't doubt that it'd be easy to transition to a tablet style for WP7. I'm just saying that to increase usability work will need to be done - for these components, will you cause the screen to scroll EVERYTHING, or will each 'tabs' scroll on its own? I doubt it's something programmed into WP7 when it ships. Also, lets say that I want to have this particular 'tab' take up the full screen, since I want to work with the items inside, not the others in the other 'unused' 'tabs'. Doubt it's something included in WP7 when it ships.

Take a look at the iOS for the iPad - I must firstly say I don't like the iPad myself (far too large, locked eco system etc). The individual applications where you find your data show you only that data, and do it with images, pictures, and recognizable icons. On a phone, you might be able to spot a text button for WP7 quickly, but in a Tablet, where there's just so much text? It'd take time, and as you can tell by the success of the iPhone due to the simplicity of it's UI amongst other things (the simplicity gets trumpeted the most by reviewers as well), this time is something most consumers do not want to spend.

It'd take some rehaul of the UI itself before it can truly compete with the iPad.

[medion]

Originally Posted by rickysio

That's what WinCE 7 (or something) is for - too bad Asus canned that tablet running it (AFAIK).

It was Windows 7. WinCE 7 hasn't been made available to OEMs yet. The last WinCE made available is WinCE 6 R3. The tablet was likely running Windows 7.

As for UI, I'd think many would appreciate it if companies worked like SPB - make the custom UI optional, and separate from the OS. So now at least you have a choice - upgrade and wait for the UI to be ported over, or remain, rather than being forced to remain.

The problem with SPB's (and Launcher Pro for Android) strategy is that the UI is essentially an app, running over the existing UI. Sense is integrated into the OS itself, which leads to better performance.

So both have their tradeoffs. Being a layer over is means quicker updates and more options for the user, but also more sluggish performance. Pick your poison.

[Olley]

IMO it will take more than a great UI to compete with the iPad. You'll need an amazing screen, light weight, long battery life between charges, and a shell that's easier on the eyes and easier to hold than the iPad's case. Throw in a great assortment of apps and enough processing power to run everything well. Then take a clue from Cowon's latest models (S9 and J3) and put a CHOICE of UIs/skins on it. Some like lists to select from. Some like icon arrays. Some like hubs. I kinda like the UI on the iriver P7 (magazine style).

[EnzoTen]

Originally Posted by rickysio

This is what happens when Microsoft doesn't sell their hardware in Singapore. Or any country other than the US.

Here are the launch countries for WP7: Australia, Austria, Belgium, Canada, France, Germany, Hong Kong, India, Ireland, Italy, Mexico, New Zealand, Singapore, Spain, Switzerland, UK and United States.

Oddly, it will launch in the EU a month before the US

[rickysio]

Ahh, but the Kin AND ZuneHD never came to SG.

Besides, I'd suggest a heavy flop - many of my fellow country men are iTards, iFans, iFanatics, etc.

[rickysio]

Originally Posted by medion

It was Windows 7. WinCE 7 hasn't been made available to OEMs yet. The last WinCE made available is WinCE 6 R3. The tablet was likely running Windows 7.



The problem with SPB's (and Launcher Pro for Android) strategy is that the UI is essentially an app, running over the existing UI. Sense is integrated into the OS itself, which leads to better performance.

So both have their tradeoffs. Being a layer over is means quicker updates and more options for the user, but also more sluggish performance. Pick your poison.

SPB are not really sluggish - even on the MSM7200A chipset (ARM11 CPU clocked at 528MHz), SPB Mobile Shell was as quick as the WinMo stock UI. ADW... can't speak about their Launcher Pro - I don't have a 'normal' android phone to test it with.

Let me find the tablet - I know for sure that it was running WinCE 7. The woes of having too many tech websites I visit is that I don't remember where I saw something.

[rickysio]

http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/mob...121-hands-on/2

As for the hardware inside, we know it's Nvidia Tegra powered - we assume and heard it was Tegra 2 - however we're waiting on confirmation from Asus on this. Apparently it has 340MB of memory to play with (we assume some is dedicated to graphics) and it was running on Microsoft's recently announced Windows Embedded Compact 7, Build 1344, compiled on May 28 2010. Asus' own software shell then runs over the top of this giving a smartphone style smooth and flowing, but currently limited functional interface.

Time to dig again and find the canning announcement.

Edit : Mmkay, not really canned, per se.
http://www.netbooknews.com/4832/asus...-with-android/

Today the Netbook News team went down to the ASUS headquarters to hang out with the Eee Pad team, and we learned something that actually made us breath a sigh of relief. The EP101TC pad will dropping Windows CE and will be shipped with Android. Rather than running an outdated Windows CE, ASUS and the majority of tablet manufacturers will be relying on Google’s Operating System. There is no further insight in Android 3.0 or Gingerbread but we have to admit we are pretty curious to find out what happens in the Fall. ASUS is planning on waiting for the 3.0 dust to settle and launch in Q1 of 2011 with products on display at CES. If you just can’t wait until January, you might be able to grab a sneak peak with some telcos as they will be delivering the good first to them in December.

Just changed. (netbooknews apparently didn't bother to find out that it was WinCE 7, instead thinking that it was the outdated WinCE 6.)

[medion]

Originally Posted by rickysio

SPB are not really sluggish - even on the MSM7200A chipset (ARM11 CPU clocked at 528MHz), SPB Mobile Shell was as quick as the WinMo stock UI. ADW... can't speak about their Launcher Pro - I don't have a 'normal' android phone to test it with.

Oh don't get me wrong, I ran it on that very chipset on a Samsung Epix. What I'm saying is that when it's run at the OS layer rather than on top of it, you have better performance. SPB is lightweight, and it was run on a competent chipset. But Launcher Pro, even on a Snapdragon or OMAP will run slower than the stock UI.

It's give and take.

Originally Posted by rickysio

http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/mob...121-hands-on/2



Time to dig again and find the canning announcement.

Edit : Mmkay, not really canned, per se.
http://www.netbooknews.com/4832/asus...-with-android/


Just changed. (netbooknews apparently didn't bother to find out that it was WinCE 7, instead thinking that it was the outdated WinCE 6.)

Thanks for the update. Appreciate the links

[rickysio]

Well, Launcher Pro should fly with some GPU acceleration.

I've seen comments that state that Launcher Pro is faster than ADW (ignore that snippet in my post above in this thread, I'm a novice in Android custom UIs) even on stock phones, and ADW flies on my N900. Good times ahead.

[medion]

Originally Posted by rickysio

Well, Launcher Pro should fly with some GPU acceleration.

You're ignoring my point, so I'll steer you back. Launcher Pro and SPB are essentially apps that run on top of the OS'es UI. Custom UIs like Sense are fully integrated and replace the UI. The trade offs are as follows;

With the integrated approach, you get better performance and fewer bugs, but a slower release cycle for updates. With the layer approach, you get a quicker release cycle for the main OS, but more limited performance.

Sure, you can argue till you're blue in the face about ways to get around the performance, but those same things would also boost the performance of integrated solutions like Sense. Integrated will always be superior to an external solution in terms of performance. You can accept these trade offs and move on, or you can continue to debate something that is factually already proven.

[rickysio]

Originally Posted by medion

You're ignoring my point, so I'll steer you back. Launcher Pro and SPB are essentially apps that run on top of the OS'es UI. Custom UIs like Sense are fully integrated and replace the UI. The trade offs are as follows;

With the integrated approach, you get better performance and fewer bugs, but a slower release cycle for updates. With the layer approach, you get a quicker release cycle for the main OS, but more limited performance.

Sure, you can argue till you're blue in the face about ways to get around the performance, but those same things would also boost the performance of integrated solutions like Sense. Integrated will always be superior to an external solution in terms of performance. You can accept these trade offs and move on, or you can continue to debate something that is factually already proven.

I'm just saying that given the rate technology improves, not far off in the future the performance trade off for external VS integrated will be negligible. I'm not trying to argue that Integrated will be superior to External - just saying that soonish, the difference will be merely on paper, and no noticeable difference in practise.

[Chief1177]

@ ezoten

dude u have like every thing

[Fecal Face]

Originally Posted by EnzoTen

Here are the launch countries for WP7: Australia, Austria, Belgium, Canada, France, Germany, Hong Kong, India, Ireland, Italy, Mexico, New Zealand, Singapore, Spain, Switzerland, UK and United States.

Oddly, it will launch in the EU a month before the US

Canada! Hooray!

Hopefully when WP7 releases in those countries, it brings the Zune Marketplace / Pass with it, seeing how WP7 is part-Zune..

Also, I think WP7 would look great on a tablet. They would have to change the UI a little, (for example make the home screen have more than two columns of tiles) but if they did it right, it would be an awesome tablet IMO.

[Intel_Atom]

ExoPC will kill 'em all. And Yes, ExoPC actually works. Check out their YouTube videos about how it works:

http://www.exopc.com/en/exopc-slate.php

Its so cool, you can order one now, but its only from Ciara-Tech until the ExoPC company talks with some US partners to put it in US stores. I can't wait!!!

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