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Old 02-24-2012, 05:36 PM
meanwhile meanwhile is offline
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 140

Originally Posted by Marvin the Martian View Post
I would substitute "Apple fans" above with the word "audiofools" and if you needed any further proof of that, it is on the RedWine page itself...
Go on to click that link and you'll find this.....

Anyone who would buy that stuff is a fool indeed!
I have to confess: I'm sometimes tempted to set up a business selling magic cables - or even better, those special rocks or pieces of wood that supposedly absorb evil resonances - myself...

Originally Posted by saratoga View Post
I don't understand what you're trying to do. Quoting people who understand this better then you doesn't help you if you do not understand anything you're reading. And clearly you do not given some of the fools you've tried to hold up as experts.
This is a failure of very basic logic on your part.

1. I didn't quote Redwine as experts: I quoted them as evidence that people with Apple players don't think they are the same as each other.

2. That Redwine sell high priced cables to idiots does not mean that another product they engineer is poor or that they don't understand audio engineering. I hate to shock you, but there is a thing in business called "profit".

3. If I had misunderstood Redwine, that would mean nothing at all concerning the validity of the quote from nwavguy. It is either correct or incorrect regardless of its route of transmission to you. That you do not understand this is, frankly, weird.

Originally Posted by skip252 View Post
And you assume that I haven't volume matched each generation of Touch and Clip, recorded the signal, then put the results to ABX testing for what reason?
I don't assume that. But if you had done so, then it would have intelligent of you ***to make the fact clear.*** Which you did not. For you to perform that ABX test meaningfully even for yourself, you'd need every generation of Clip and Touch together at a single time and location, which is a pretty weird thing that does need pointing out!

More, one abx test does not produce absolute certainty that two players sound the same! It just proves they sound the same ***to that individual***, with whatever IEMs or phones he used. To make meaningful generalizations about what other people will probably hear, you need a pretty large population of test subjects and repeated tests.

..So I rather think that you're in danger of replacing one set of voodoo beliefs (magic cables etc) with another (abuse of the scientific method to extrapolate results impossible from the claimed experiment.) And by "danger" I mean "This is in fact what you have already done."

Also, once again:

- Measurements taken by a competent engineer suggest that the clip and pod will sound different to at least some people, with some iems/phones. No person who understood what an ABX test can actually do would disregard this until a considerable population of test results said otherwise. Until then a difference in SQ is a distinct possibility that has to be weighed against the actual cost of comparing for the actual user.

- Trying the clip or fuse has the advantage that, if they are preferred, the OP will make a profit selling the Touch. The main common sense reason - cost - of experimenting with players doesn't really apply here. Fuze as good or better: sell Touch, make much money. Otherwise: return Fuze. Fuzes are cheap, used Touchs sell for a damn good price. Why keep an expensive Touch if after trying a cheaper player it is preferred? It shouldn't require a Black Monolith to grok this logic -money good!

Last edited by skip252; 02-24-2012 at 05:50 PM. Reason: Posts merged again. Last warning, stop multi posting.
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